Repro site might be selling games in our covers.

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PDDestro:

--- Quote from: AppleQueso on August 03, 2010, 05:06:42 PM ---So are the folks who have made custom cart labels and box arts designed to be used for repros such as these "scumbags" by association? What about folks such as Shenske, who's expressed interest in having a reproduction cart made of Star Fox 2. Is he a scumbag as well for facilitating these people?

Yeah, it's illegal, so is what we do on this site. I don't see you threatening to report us though.

--- End quote ---

Again, dancing around the issue. Bootlegging = for profit. Do you not understand the moral, let alone legal, difference between the two? I'm starting to think you have some sort of connection to this website with how you so vigorously defended it from the get go.

AppleQueso:
I'm not so much defending that site as I am defending reproduction cart makers all around. I actually think that somebody putting effort in so that I can play, say, Secret of Mana 2 in english on my actual SNES is really cool. I take a bit of offense to the "scumbag" remark, because I've considered having a reproduction cart made (though probably not from this guy). I feel like you're calling me as well as the folks who made these labels to begin with a scumbag by association.

I also think threatening legal action (that could land the guy in prison) because he didn't give explicit credit to us for using labels (created with copyrighted images) that he likely didn't even know came from us to begin with is a bit extreme. Has anybody even bothered to email this guy? I'm sure he'd oblige with giving credit or even simply using a different default cover/label. Wanting to destroy someone's livelihood over something so petty, however, is something I do have moral issues with, sorry.

(besides if we threatened to report him, there's little stopping him from reporting us right back)

And hey, if I did have something to do with that site, why the hell would I steal cover art from here? Don't you think I'd likely make my own or at least ask permission? I'm honestly pretty annoyed that I'm being accused of being part of this.

BadChad:
Before we go as far to say "he's a scumbag who's ripping people off with his scam site" did any think maybe it was someone from here who gave them to him. Ive been talking to him about this yesterday and today.

When I asked him about it he said that he had gotten them from from someone els who was claiming them as their own. I started with proving that the MM&B cover was infact mine and also provided links to the rest of the covers by the other artists. He told me he would email the guy who sent them to him about it.

Heres what I got today:

Gamereproducions:
-did he send you a message on there??

Me:
-I dont think so? I dont even know who "he" is lol.

Gamereproductions:
-protoman81, says he sent you a pm on there

Me:
-He might of at some point asked to use it for himself before, I dont
remember. But I sure dont remember him telling me he was going to be
sending them off to other people as his own. Is he the one who sent
you the rest of the covers too?

Gamereproductions:
- yeah. He claims they are his and people found them on his photobucket
account and put them on there claiming as their own :o

Me:
-Thanks for letting me know! Im sure the others will be happy to know about
this aswell. Theres a bit of conflict going on about the issue right now so I hope
you dont mind Ill be clearing the air over at the forums.

So AQ was right when he said "that artwork was likely provided to him by a third party". One of those covers was mine and I was a little upset but I wasnt going to trash talk his site and the services he provides. I bought my first 4 NES repro carts from him a few years ago and I was very pleased with what I got and the price seemed pretty reasonable to me.

AppleQueso:
Exactly what I thought was going on.

Still think he's a scumbag Von Doom? eh you probably do.

PDDestro:
OK, it seems you are misunderstanding me at a fundamental level. Ultimately, bootlegging morally enrages me because it is not only taking another's work without permission, but on top of that profiting off of it! Not just for personal use, but commercial profit! I.E. making a living or at least some sort of additional income off of the works of others w/o permission or payment. Yes, what he does takes labor, but nowhere even close to the labor the game creators, fan translator/hackers, and the like engage in to make what we all here love (games). And in the process they do not see a dime of his profit for their hard earned work! If you can't see why it is wrong to make a profit of another's works than I can't help you. All his labor is zilch without the games, hacks, and translations. And on the issue of fan hacks and translation those people go years working for free to make something for fans to enjoy and this guy is making money off of it! >:(

I do agree that it's really cool to have your own repro cart. But not if it means enabling a bootlegger. That's where I draw the line. The law is clear and either he is very ignorant of it, which doesn't hold up in court, or he's misleading his customers to make a profit. In which case he deserves what he gets.

As for the issue of reporting him in conjunction with taking covers from here, well that isn't correct. As, I've known about that site for a good while now. So, it's not as much that he's taking covers but that he's burning off roms and selling them to begin with. The covers issue is just the cherry on top of it all! One shouldn't make their livelihood on dishonest work.

As for being accused, I only wondered aloud because of how vigorous you've been in this back and forth argument. Especially when it's concerning something that, to me, seems so simple, morally speaking. Usually when a simple moral premise is avoided, ignored, or berated there is an ulterior motive behind it.

You don't think it's a big deal, but clearly by the laws, financial penalties, and criminal repercussions involved it is a very big deal.

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